Solidarity HealthShare’s Chief Medical Officer Dr. John Oertle joined The BS Show to discuss the importance of midwifery recently. Listen to the interview or read the transcript below.
Bob Sansevere (00:00):
We are joined by Dr. John Oertle, the co-founder and chief medical officer for Solidarity HealthShare at solidarityhealthshare.org. Doctor, it’s interesting, I was looking at an article that you had written a blog for Solidarity HealthShare, and what’s interesting is earlier this month, starting the week of October 5th, it was national midwifery or midwifery week, depending on how you want to say it. As I mentioned, off the air, tomato, tomato, potato, potato, but it shouldn’t get a week. It should get an entire month. And when I saw it that every October there is the week my daughter is due to give birth on November 18th and she plans to have a midwife involved and she also is on the K102 morning show, which is, they have been the highest rated morning show in the nation for country music and they won a big CMA award as like the best personalities in morning radio in the country and they’re going to, her due date is the 18th and the 19th of November is the awards night and she really wants to be there and she, the baby doesn’t come the week before. There’s no way I can go. I said, what do you mean you tell your company to rent you an RV and you get a midwife to go with you? Maybe even obstetrician, but as I had read this, I had just been talking about midwives, so okay, midwifery- would you call it?
Dr. John Oertle (01:32):
So, your daughter? Sounds like quite a heroin to be able to actually be accomplished in all of that, so that is incredible.
Bob Sansevere (01:38):
Yeah, and she told me a couple of days before they made the announcement that I know we’re going to win because it doesn’t look like I can get there. Okay, so it’s midwifery. What about “Midwife?” Is it “Midwife?”
Dr. John Oertle (01:50):
More people are choosing midwives. This is what we’ve seen is that women and couples are choosing midwives or at least to be able to have midwives be a part of their birth experience. We’ve seen this increase over the last, again, ever since probably close to about now 15 years. And so 2012 it was close to about 11%. Now we’re actually, this was the data-
Bob Sansevere (02:12):
16, 20, 22, probably
Dr. John Oertle (02:14):
Over that 16% and so we’re definitely seeing an increase in people that are recognizing the benefits and the values of actually having a style of practitioner, like a midwife being able to attend your birth.
Bob Sansevere (02:26):
Well, what’s interesting too, because again, I read the story and I was thinking, well at a hospital birth home or birth center at home, I think that’s a little dangerous, but the numbers say that it’s not as long as you know that you’re not having a struggle during your pregnancy, basically. Actually before the 20th century, most babies were born with a midwife, maybe a doctor went, but I mean worldwide most, I mean I don’t know, are worldwide most babies delivered by a midwife? A lot of countries without doctors available?
Dr. John Oertle (03:04):
Most are midwives are involved in the birthing experience for most countries worldwide. And so this is where too, what we see is that you’re right that again, it’s actually can be very safe. You’re talking about low risk pregnancies when low risk risk pregnancies when it’s low risk, and this is what a midwife is really trained to be able to do with all the birthing experiences that she’s had and going through mentorship to be able to get certified as a midwife that again, they really are seeking out being able to make sure that it is, that if it’s any mid or high risk pregnancy or if there’s any complications within that pregnancy, they’re referring you to a hospital. Maybe they can continue. I’ve seen patients too where they continue with the care and they’re with the mom, but they’re also having a OB that’s there present or a maternal fetal medicine doctor that’s also a part of their care team.
(04:00):
But this is where when you are doing it correctly, if it’s a low risk pregnancy, the data shows that again, you’re not higher risk. Actually, quite the contrary. It’s really interesting in our data too that I write about in my blog that I think is really important is that we’ve seen that even the data of maternal death rates in the United States are actually higher than other developed countries across the world. And so I oftentimes think what is the reason for that? And one of the reasons I do believe it is, is because of the system of obstetrics. We have great obstetricians, but one of the things is that when you have this more, this ability, I write about it in my blog, the aftercare, that postnatal time when a woman delivers, and that’s great. It can be the hospital under an OB, but then that postnatal time when they’re recovering, many times it’s striking to me when you look at the data on average here in the United States is that women, because they may not go back to their doctor or may not go back to that follow-up appointment on average, go back to the OB after delivery zero to one times what on average-
Bob Sansevere (05:10):
What? Really?
Dr. John Oertle (05:11):
And this is just wild to me because if you’re having bleeding complications or if you’re having hypertension, many times you don’t know it. And this is where even though the death rate, maternal death rate is still very low, it is still too high for a developed country here in the United States, but this is where I think midwifery or midwifery can provide this alternative because the midwife is going to the patient’s home and checking in, and many times they’re actually going six times to be able to keep checking in on the wife making it more convenient. And this is the statistics or averages that midwives are going and checking in about six times in that after delivery timeline. And so I think you do see that this could be a help to be able to help bring up and that safety for women, especially during that after delivery time. And I think midwifery presents a very tangible option to be able to help support.
Bob Sansevere (06:12):
Well, let me ask this about it, because midwives use, because obviously if you’re having a midwife, my daughter’s had a number of ultrasounds and she did because she had, and she talked about it on her show, so it’s no secret she had two miscarriages and she had to have surgery because something was misshapen and they did it and I think she was able to get pregnant and keep the baby, and it looks like it’s going to be a healthy baby. But here’s a question I have. Do the midwives want to see the ultrasounds? And the reason I ask is my wife, we had five kids, they all had big heads and she had an episiotomy to deliver each child, which is basically making a little more room for the kid to come out. How does a midwife know and what do they do? They just keep pushing her. Sometimes those heads are pretty big. How do they know?
Dr. John Oertle (07:07):
They are. So, yeah, so midwives are using all of that in the prenatal screening process. Midwives are doing ultrasounds, sending women to imaging centers to get their ultrasounds just like even OBS do be able-
Bob Sansevere (07:18):
Oh, okay.
Dr. John Oertle (07:19):
To refer out to do ultrasounds, to be able to view anatomy scans. And so midwives are using that same technology, just being able to have home visits essentially,
Bob Sansevere (07:29):
But they never have a scalpel in their hands.
Dr. John Oertle (07:30):
What’s beautiful though is that many times these interventions that are done in the hospital, like you mentioned, the episiotomy midwives aren’t doing that because they’re also, what I find to be really beautiful and what a lot of women find attractive in this process is that they’re using more of this, again, these natural means. Maybe they’re using heat to be able to help loosen up those muscles to be able to actually allow for an easier delivery so that it opens up the tissue. Or you have, say for instance, you use now, it’s more common in hospitals that they actually have bathtubs, the tubs that you, the birthing tubs that are actually a part of that that started in the midwifery movements to be able to actually have these water births happening at home where you could be in a tub or having that actual tub. It takes care of the pain so you don’t have to have as many painkillers or you can have the birth neutrally, but it helps to open up that tissue so that a baby can be delivered a little more easily as well.
Bob Sansevere (08:29):
That’s interesting.
Dr. John Oertle (08:30):
Where the beauty is because midwives have done it without these interventions for centuries, these trips and tricks, they know the things that think about those old tips and tricks that your grandmother used to use to be able to help with cold and flu that have been passed down through the centuries that have been currently lost in our generations are continued to be practiced in those actual midwifery settings because this is where it’s worked. This is what women have gone through to be able to deliver babies for centuries.
Bob Sansevere (09:02):
What percentage of the midwives are men? Are they mid husbands? No. I mean are there any that do it?
Dr. John Oertle (09:07):
There’s got to be know Bob. I don’t know that statistic, but I will say I’ve never met one male midwife. I just don’t think it happens. I’ve not met one.
Bob Sansevere (09:16):
Well, I mean if you’re the husband, hey, you’re not going down there.
Dr. John Oertle (09:22):
I oftentimes do joke with my male friends though, because again, it’s this, yes, childbirth is one of the most difficult things for a woman as far as that goes to be able to go through. But again, this is all very good and we want to be able to support the women going through this care. But I’m always saying the men, I always say jokingly, tongue in cheek that it’s a very stressful experience for the husband. I said, I think we need to, maybe we need to be able to have a mid husbandry –
Bob Sansevere (09:49):
Doctor.
Dr. John Oertle (09:51):
Something for our guys.
Bob Sansevere (09:52):
I’m going to tell you something. You have met, you are talking to the first mid husband because I delivered our fifth and final child. I’d watched the first four and the doctor said, you want this one? I shoved them over and does it count if I’m the one who takes the baby out, does that make me a midwife?
Dr. John Oertle (10:10):
It’s got to count for something. Bob.
Bob Sansevere (10:12):
I’m at least a partial midwife. No one gave me a thing on midwifery week. I’m disappointed.
Dr. John Oertle (10:19):
I need to be able to send you a box of chocolates.
Bob Sansevere (10:22):
Something, because I was there. I was right there taking that baby out. So, alright, I got to remind people. Solidarity HealthShare, solidarityhealthshare.org, great alternative to traditional healthcare and it’s a lot less expensive. You need to look into it. Doctor, always enjoy talking.
Dr. John Oertle (10:40):
And we share into, as an alternative to healthcare that we actually share into that midwifery is included. So we’re one of the only ones that actually we, all of our members that are choosing to have midwives, home births, birthing centers, or having your full obstetrics care at a hospital, all of those are options for our members. So phenomenal. It’s a wonderful thing when we have a lot of people joining our membership as a result of wanting to be able to have that more comprehensive care that’s able to be a part of the membership.
Bob Sansevere (11:09):
Well, again, it’s solidarityhealthshare.org, check it out, we’ll take a quick break. The BS Show‘ll be right back.
